Solid Guidance to Successfully Market to Asian Americans. What You MUST Know to Avoid Failure!

Welcome. This is the public relations review podcast, a program to discuss the many facets of public relations with seasoned professionals, educators, authors, and others. Now, here is your host. Peter will folk

Welcome to the public relations review podcast and to our listeners all across America and around the world. By now, we all know that the composition of the us population is changing and as PR and marketing people, we need to understand this growth and how to best reach these of market and these varying population segments. Now, according to pew research, the nation's Asian population rolls to 22.4 million in 2019. Asians now make up about 7% of the us population. Now there are about 20 different Asian groups in America. Uh, in, in America, Chinese Americans are the largest Asian group making up 24% of the population at about 5.4 million. The next two largest groups are Indian Americans who account for 21% or about 4.6 million and Filipinos who account for 19% at 4.2 million. Now in descending of Vietnamese, that 2.2 million Koreans at 1.9 million and Japanese at 1.5 million population, the other groups will count for 12% of the us, uh, Asian population totalling about 2.7 million. So why is this important? My guess that they can answer that question in detail and what you absolutely must know before you can penetrate the Asian American market. So joining me today from Dublin, California is Dr. Michael soon Lee president of ethno connect. Now ethno connect provides seminars, training, consulting, and coaching on how to sell more products and services to Asian Americans. She has been a college professor, the marketing director for the state of California and a producer for ABC television network. He has written numerous books and has spoken on this matter around the world. And now he's on our podcast. Michael, thank you so much for joining us today.

It's my pleasure, Peter. Thank you for having me

Well, now that we've, I've, uh, read that entry. Why is it, and what is the number one reason that we should want to market to the Asian American community?

Well, Peter, as you mentioned, Asians are growing rapidly, 7% of the us population and growing rapidly. Uh, but the main reason is Asians in America have the highest median income. Uh, in 2020, the Asian average median income was$94,900 compared to white. non-Hispanic at about 75,000 Hispanics at 55,000 and blacks at about 46,000. So you're talking about a rapidly growing and very high income group. They have money to buy Peter

<laugh> well, that certainly wants to really wants you, cause you to pay attention. So now you also say that there are some absolute differences that one must learn about the Asian groups before they can be attracted to marketing efforts. So let's go down that list of, of what those, uh, absolutes are.

Well, I think as you mentioned early on Peter, the first thing you've gotta understand is Asians are not one big happy family. Uh, you mentioned the fact that there are Chinese as the largest group, then you have Asian Indians and Filipinos and all of the 20 plus groups are very, very different. They all have different languages, different for different religions. You name it. They are very different. In fact, they don't all get along. My mother when I was in high school and uh, beginning to date, uh, she said, don't you ever bring a Japanese girl into this house? And I said, mom, we're Chinese Japanese look just like us. And she said, absolutely not. No they don't. And during world war II, the Japanese were very cruel to the Chinese don't you ever bring a Japanese girl into this house? So Peter, what nationality do you think was the first girl I brought home?<laugh> she as Japanese<laugh> mm-hmm mm-hmm<affirmative>, but you know, they, we are very different groups. So as I mentioned, just for example, you know, Asians in general have the highest median income, but we also have the highest poverty rates amongst, for example, the ESE, which are, uh, south east Asians, they have the highest poverty rate of any group in the United States. So the first thing you wanna do, if you're trying to market to the Asian population is to figure out specifically which Asian group are you trying to reach, uh, which Asian group has the most for your product or service. And then you wanna learn about that group again, you know, what, what is their favorite food? What, uh, you know, what do they believe in what holidays do they celebrate? And those kinds of things, because each group is so very different.

Well,

But one of the things we've gotta understand when we're marketing is unfortunately in the first 30 seconds, most untrained marketers and sales people who are trying to reach the Asian community at the Asian market is that unfortunately in the first 30 seconds, if you're not trained, you will unintentionally insult an Asian customer at least three times in the first 30 seconds.

Well, let's talk specifically about what those things or that could cause that sort of a insult,

Well, it depends on whether you're meeting them in person or you're marketing to them through the media, but let's just take, you know, if you're meeting someone for the first time, uh, in a store, uh, on their doorstep as a salesperson, what's the first thing we're taught to do as sales people, Peter

Basically extend your hand and say, hello.

Absolutely. But in the new global world, and it's true, not just for Asians, but for a lot of different cultural groups around the world, you do not want to extend your hand, uh, to shake because just to touch a Japanese woman, a traditional Japanese woman, a traditional Asian, Indian woman, a traditional middle Eastern woman, you would absolutely insult not only her, but her husband, her family, her, her religion, and her culture to try and even touch her. Because in those cultures, the only people who are allowed to touch them in any way, shape or form are their spouse or family members. Mm-hmm<affirmative>. And that's it. So the question then becomes, if you're meeting someone in person, how do you meet, uh, an Asian or someone who normally doesn't shake hands or would feel uncomfortable, shaking hands. And the answer Peter is you greet them verbally. Hi, I'm Michael Lee, welcome to our store. And then you hesitate for a moment and see what they do first. What kind of greeting do they feel comfortable? Obviously, if they're comfortable in shaking hands, uh, the man is gonna put his hand out, go ahead and shake it. Mm-hmm

<affirmative>

Probably the woman won't do that. But if the doesn't put his hand out now, what do you do? He's probably just gonna nod to you, which is sort of the modern version of bowing, which has been done for thousands of years. But the modern version now is just to kind of nod to show you respect sort of a half bow. And what do we do exactly what they do. If they bow to us or nod to us, we do the same. And then we turn to the woman, don't put your hand out, see what she does. Mm-hmm<affirmative> she will most likely bow to you or nod to you. And you just do the same. And that's true, not just with Asians, but any cultural group around the world. These days just do what they do. And Peter isn't that the ultimate in good customer service doing what's comfortable for the customer, not what's comfortable for us.

You know, I certainly agree with that. And what I'm hearing you say right now is the very first thing you need to do is understand what group you're dealing with and understand what the culture of that group is. So that you don't have a major snapo on your hands, uh, at, at the initial greeting.

And actually you don't need to know anything about culture. These days. Many people, even people born in the us grew up in the us many generations back. They may not feel comfortable in shaking hands. And it's not just because of COVID a lot of folks in the south, they don't feel comfortable in shaking hands. They would prefer just to, again, just nod at you or smile at you. Mm-hmm<affirmative>. So how do you know how anybody wants to be greeted these days, instead of assuming, just introduce yourself and observe, see what they do first. Okay. And then just do the same mm-hmm

<affirmative> watch, watch and observe,

Watch and observe mm-hmm<affirmative>. But with Asians, one of the things you gotta watch out for is eye contact in America. Peter, what does good strong eye contact mean to us?

Confidence is certainly one of them

And, and honesty too, right? Mm-hmm

<affirmative>

And paying attention and showing respect. That's what we believe in America. But in many Asian cultures, particularly the Japanese cultures, some, some Chinese cultures and many of American cultures, they don't look you in the eye out of respect for you, but for Americans, man, that is so uncomfortable. Mm-hmm<affirmative>, we're trying to get good, strong eye contact and they're looking away just be comfortable with it and recognize this is what they are comfortable with and just do the same. Mm-hmm<affirmative> just look down, look away wherever they're looking, but just don't try to get eye contact because they can feel, you try to look at'em and it's gonna make them feel very uncomfortable. And that could actually ruin your whole relationship from the beginning. If you don't give them the same level of eye contact, they give you, or if you try and shake their hand and they don't want it again, you're gonna be trying to recover from that, uh, for, I don't know how long, but it could really make your relationship very uncomfortable from the very start mm-hmm

<affirmative>. You know, these, this is some very, very important information. So let's, let's keep on with this because as I said, I had no idea and I'm sure most of our listen, this don't. So let let's keep going with some of the other things we need to be aware of.

Well, personal space is very personal to us. And in America, we like to stand about two and a half to three feet apart when we're talking to someone we're not really very familiar with yet. And so in America, we shake hands, we drop our hands. We're standing about two and a half feet apart. And that tends to be our comfortable, uh, personal space distance. But in many Asian cultures, they are much more formal. The Japanese people will no or bow to you. And then they will take a step back because they like a lot of personal space. In fact, Japanese probably want the most personal space of any group in the world. The problem with that is for an American, when a Japanese person steps back into a more comfortable personal space for them, that's now like the grand canyon to us. Mm-hmm<affirmative> so what do you think Peter is our natural tendency. When a space opens up like that and that's not comfortable for us, what do we do?

Something tells me we might wanna step closer to them.

Absolutely. That's more comfortable for us. Mm-hmm<affirmative> but then that violates the Japanese person's personal space. So now what do they do? Peter?

<laugh> shifted to reversal game.<laugh>

They step back. We step forward. We all over the room. Mm-hmm<affirmative> and do you think that's comfortable for the Japanese person?

Probably not very, very,

Why are you following me? I want more personal space. You keep, you know what, it's what we would consider in America, close talking. And we hate that. And the Japanese hate people that close up their personal space as well. And it's a funny thing to kind of watch at a party or a networking meeting. You'll watch a Japanese person slowly backing up away from the or D and all of a sudden, you know, the, the American will follow them and eventually they'll be 15 feet away against a wall. It's hilarious. And yet it's somewhat sad because you can see that relationship is not going anywhere.

Well, let me ask a quick question then, because is there a difference in these cultures, depending upon the age of the person we're talking about, because we've got a lot of, let's say Japanese students that are here going to school and so forth and so on, and maybe just out of school, how do they observe that those cultural differences there?

Well, it's not necessarily age Peter it's what generation are you dealing with?

Okay.

So the first generation of any group, Asian, Hispanic, black, it doesn't matter. The first generation comes to the United States is the first generation. And they're the ones that have the most beliefs. And we should talk about cultural beliefs in a minute, but they're the ones that are the most uncomfortable with the American culture, the English one language. And they're the ones that are most sensitive to these cultural differences. The second generation are the first generation to be born in the United States. These are Americans mm-hmm<affirmative>, and they tend to be bilingual because they learn the language of their ancestors from their parents, but they also learn English in the school. So they tend to make good interpreters, but they tend to have less of the beliefs and the cultural attributes of their parents. The first generation, the next generation are the children of the people born here. So they are generation and beyond. So as you become acculturated to the United States, you have less and less of these cultural beliefs and effects. But when that goes away, nobody knows because culture runs there very deep mm-hmm<affirmative> in the old days, Peter, you re you may remember. We were taught that when immigrants come to the United States, it was like, uh, a melting pot. And we all contributed our culture, but we all became Americans. We became one big stew, but today cultures tend to hang on to, uh, their language and their beliefs and their food much longer. So today we are more like a salad where you can see all the wonderful ingredients and it's a wonderful meal, but you can still see the tomato and the carrots and the individual components, but it all comes together to make a really delicious meal. Mm-hmm<affirmative>. But again, it depends on how long they've been here. So if you're dealing with a student who's been in this country for five or 10 years, they're gonna have less cultural impact. And they're gonna be more aware that, you know, Americans behave this way. My culture behaves that way, but when you're dealing with the first generation who grew up in another country, thinking that their culture and the way they did things was the norm. It's, you know, you need to be very sensitive as a marketer, as a salesperson mm-hmm<affirmative>. So if you're marketing to Asians, number one, one thing you've gotta do is in your ads show Asians

Mm-hmm

<affirmative>, but again, come back, it comes back, Peter two, you gotta know which culture mm-hmm<affirmative> because if you're trying to market to the Japanese, you better not show Chinese people because they can tell most people can't, but Asians can tell the difference by looking at another Asian, they can tell whether you're Chinese, Japanese, Korean, Filipino, they can tell, and they can sometimes tell which generation you are.

Hmm.

So number one, use Asian images use the right ones and be sure that, you know, how they use your product or service mm-hmm<affirmative>. So that it's in the right context because otherwise Asians will totally ignore ads. That number one, don't have Asians in them. And number two, don't have the specific group that they are,

You know, this brings up an interesting point. Then it sounds to me that if in fact, uh, I've got a PR firm or, or a marketing firm that wants to reach an Asian group, I should have someone from that group right. In this center of my team. That's putting this marketing campaign together because these are the things I'm gonna call.'em subtleties that most folks may not pick up unless they've been around a particular Asian group for a long, long time.

Yeah. And you wanna have more than just one Peter, because that one may not be consistent with the group that you're trying to reach. Mm-hmm<affirmative>. So, for example, if you are trying to reach new immigrant Chinese Americans, and you had me on your team, I would have not a clue about immigrant Chinese and their needs and their wants, and their relationship to your product because I'm fifth generation mm-hmm<affirmative>. My ancestors came here in 1855 and I speak no Chinese, thanks to the California public school system. Peter mm-hmm<affirmative> I speak, I speak Spanish.

<laugh> okay.

<laugh> so I'm not, I'm not gonna be very helpful, but I can help you with Asian Americans. Mm-hmm<affirmative> because that's who I am. That's my level of expertise. Uh, so you've gotta be very, very careful and recognize that amongst Asians, there can be different dialects of different languages. If you're trying to do a print ad, if you're trying to, uh, do voiceover that has Chinese in it, for example, you know, my ancestor came from China and they all spoke Cantonese, but the new immigrants, these days coming from mainland China, they almost all speak Mandarin and they're not very compatible mm-hmm<affirmative>. So you've got to know specifically, and they are dialects of Mandarin. It just depends on who you're trying to reach. So working with a multicultural, really aware and really expert advertising agency who specializes in that particular group is really a central,

Well, that, that brings up a, I guess, different sort of questions and that, how does one go about, uh, getting a particular Asian group to become brand loyal or appreciate the quality of a, of a particular product? How do you go about suggesting that that happens?

Well, the first thing you've gotta is think long term, you know, the United States, our cultures, you know, 250 years old, approximately, but when you're dealing with Asian cultures, some of them are thousands of years old. Mm-hmm<affirmative> And if they see one or two ads, it has Tru no impact. If you think you're gonna go to a Chinese new year festival and have a booth and have any impact at all, I think you're mistaken. Okay. They wanna see you there time and time and time again, mm-hmm<affirmative> they wanna see your ad over and over in different ways in different media, because they wanna know that you're not just after their money, that you're here to support their community, and that you do wanna understand, and you do wanna help them with your product or service. So you've gotta think long term, you've gotta have a budget planned out for years, not just an annual budget. You have to have a decade long budget or longer if you're gonna have any impact at all. Mm-hmm

<affirmative>.

And I think a lot of our advertisers and advertising agencies think, you know, they're gonna do a super bowl ad, and they're gonna have all of this impact. Doesn't work for the Asian community in particular. And so think long term.

So this is part of, I guess I would call it building brand loyalty in that, uh, you've got to be in front of this, these groups for some extended period of time, as you said, more than just once or twice.

Absolutely. And then you've gotta understand what's important to the Asian community. And obviously we're not trying to lump everybody together, but in general, mm-hmm,<affirmative> Asians really appreciate quality because they want something that's gonna last again, long term culture they want. And if you look at the, for example of the vehicles that they drive, they will pay extra for something that has longevity that is reliable. Asians generally are not very handy. They're not mechanical. They don't wanna spend their time taking the in and having its serviced. Just as an example, mm-hmm<affirmative>, they want something that will last and they're willing to pay for it.

So how does one, let's say images, are there any particular images that, uh, that, uh, responds, they respond to a words that they respond to in collaboration with developing your sales pitches?

Well, again, what's important to Asians. The number one thing that's important to Asians in general is family. They are a very high context culture. Mm-hmm<affirmative>, which means the group is more important than the individual. And so if they don't see, for example, if you're trying to sell a car, you don't wanna show just one Asian drive down the road, enjoying, you know, the, the sunlight and, uh, the sunset. You wanna show a family having fun. Mm-hmm

<affirmative>,

Uh, out having a picnic, doing things as a group, the word family is important. The image of family is important. Mm-hmm<affirmative>, that is number one. Whereas in America, we are a very low context culture, and one is not better than the other. They're just different. But in low context cultures, you know, we are proud to be individuals. We, you could, you know, you could never in Asia sell one of those foam fingers that you buy at the stadium at a ballgame that says we are number one, Peter, you can't give those away in Asia Because they aren't. Number one mm-hmm<affirmative>, the family is number one. And so it's a different mindset. And it's hard for an American company, a advertising company, an advertiser to get out of the American mind set of just driving down the road. And you know, one person in a car that would be an Inna to an Asian. Because again, they're very frugal and they're very brand loyal, but it takes a long time to build brand loyal over and over again. But once you've got'em, it's worth it because not only are they brand loyal, they will tell their friends and family mm-hmm<affirmative> because in Asia, they, you know, they don't really a low context culture. You know, we rely on advertising, high context cultures, they rely on word of mouth And that word of mouth is crucial. Mm-hmm<affirmative>. But once you've got it, once you've built it, you got'em for a lifetime, but it's worth it.

Well, let me ask you, because one of the things that has become popular around here of course are influencers mm-hmm<affirmative> does the Asian community, are there influencers among the Asian community consent? Actually, I shouldn't say Asian because I understand the, the various subgroups there, but are there influencers that, uh, the various groups listen to?

Well for the young people, obviously there are social media influencers okay. That they follow. But for the older group, the influencers are the heads of the family, the heads of the household, uh, the ministers at the churches, the leaders in the community are the influencers mm-hmm<affirmative>. So it just depends on what product or service are you trying to sell to a particular Asian group. Their influencers are different, which is why it's important to either do your own research, which takes quite a while, or to hire a specialty agency that specializes in the Asian market. Mm-hmm

<affirmative>.

And that just can, you know, it's expensive obviously, but it can save you a great deal of time.

So one of the other things I'm getting out of this is that organizations or companies trying to reach that community really have to put in some time and effort to understand who it is that they're trying to reach, how to best reach them and<affirmative> and who, um, messenger should be. So to speak

Either, do your research or hire somebody. Um, my friend, bill Amada at the IW group, it's a Asian American specialty advertising organization. Mm-hmm<affirmative> and they can, they've already done the work so you can either hire them. Or if you've got something that's really unique and out of their area of expertise, you can do your own research, but it's going to take time and it's gonna take a fair amount of money. Mm-hmm<affirmative>

Well, Michael, this has been a very, very, in our short period of time. I mean, I've learned an awful lot of a short time that we've been here together.

Well, that's quite an honor coming from you, Peter

<laugh> well, I'm, you know, the, the learning is forever. I mean, you continue to learn. It

Is,

Well, let me ask you now, but the amount

Of the amount of interviews you do, I figured you knew every,

I I'm still learning, as I said, learning is forever, but look it is, you provided an awful lot of information. Let me ask you now, do you have any sort of closing remarks or, or wisdom tidbits that you like to impart to our, our listeners?

Well, I just wanna say Peter, my work has always been around the fact that Asians are really not a lot different than anybody else we have similar wants and needs. We all want good schools for our kids. We all wanna be financially secure, have a nice home, and who doesn't want any of those things, Peter, but there's just, I think Asian Americans are probably the least understood of any group in America. I think we understand the L G B T Q plus community better than we understand Asians. And if we would just take the time to look past some of the differences that you see on the outside, you'll see how similar we truly are on the inside. And I'm currently writing a book called the on the bamboo curtain, just so people could understand a little bit of some of the challenges that we as Asian Americans have. There's a myth out there that we're all rich. We're all well educated and that's really not true. We're an extremely diverse community. And it's important for people to understand that diversity, even within the Asian community, but to just get to know us as people mm-hmm,<affirmative>, there's been a lot of violence against the, a American community, simply because people don't understand us. Mm-hmm

<affirmative>

Again, they think, you know, we have all of the advantages. Well, we don't, we've been discriminated since the first day we arrived in the United States. Mm-hmm<affirmative> there have been laws that have to keep us out of this country that have kept us becoming from becoming American citizens. There have been laws that have kept us from, uh, becoming immigrants into the United States and on and on and on it goes, it's just, it's a little different. We do have certain privileges, which I call yellow privilege, but we don't have all of the rights that are guaranteed to Americans in this country yet. And so I hope people will just take the time to, to get to know us. As people get to know our challenges and, you know, we will then get to buy from you. We will be brand loyal, but take some time to get to know us before you try to sell to us. Mm-hmm

<affirmative> well, Michael, as I said, you have really provided us with a wealth of information. I'm certainly leading the parade to, to make that announcement. So I just thank

You, Peter.<laugh>

I'd like to say thank you to my guest today. Oh, Dr. Uh, Dr. Michael soon Lee, he's the president of ethno connect and he joined us today from Dublin, California. So if, uh, you've enjoyed it, please, uh, you know, take some notes, uh, share this information with, uh, your fellow PR folks, uh, because this is some critical and very, very vital information. And I want to gain thank Michael for Joe joining us. And if you've enjoyed the, uh, program, please give us a great review. Oh, and by the way, don't forget to look at our updated, uh, video on, uh, on YouTube at the public relationship review podcast. So once again, thank you for listen and have a great day.

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